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original chassis
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coupe
Newbie



Joined: 26 Feb 2021
Posts: 7
Location: Sydney

Posted: Sun Mar 09, 2021 3:44 pm    Post subject: original chassis

thankyou for all the imput that I recieved about my rego concerns.
After doing some homework & asking a lot of questions I think that I should tell the RTA & engineer that my chassis is an original not a Repro?
I have been told that I must have at least one original crossmember.
My chassis has a Rod City independent front end, Ford 9" rear [triangulated 4 bar].
How & where do I fit an original crossmember?
Any advice will be appreciated.
Thankyou
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Pep
500RPM



Joined: 14 Jun 2021
Posts: 567
Location: Georges Hall, NSW

Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2021 8:02 am    Post subject: Re: original chassis

coupe wrote:
thankyou for all the imput that I recieved about my rego concerns.
After doing some homework & asking a lot of questions I think that I should tell the RTA & engineer that my chassis is an original not a Repro?
I have been told that I must have at least one original crossmember.
My chassis has a Rod City independent front end, Ford 9" rear [triangulated 4 bar].
How & where do I fit an original crossmember?
Any advice will be appreciated.
Thankyou



A wise move....There are 3 cross members...The front an rear suspension use 2 of the 3...the remaining is the "X" member.
So you have an independant IFS so there goes one...The "X" member is the hardest to work around so it leaves you with the rear, which does not have to do anything more than to be there. You can use leaf spring or coil overs ( as in your case) and utilise the cross member as supports for them.....thats the easiest solution.
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Brootal
500RPM



Joined: 11 Jun 2021
Posts: 804
Location: Sydney, Australia

Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2021 10:04 am    Post subject:

Or.... you could throw out that IFS and put a proper front end in it!
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Pep
500RPM



Joined: 14 Jun 2021
Posts: 567
Location: Georges Hall, NSW

Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2021 10:41 am    Post subject:

Brootal wrote:
Or.... you could throw out that IFS and put a proper front end in it!


Geeez...you young guys...traditional?.....the seat of your pants drivin in an old flat black jalopy with a side valve V8 sittin on buggy springs aint healthy for us old farts....our false teeth might fall out when we hit the bumps
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a25Chevrod
Rookie


Joined: 15 Sep 2020
Posts: 97
Location: Gympie, Queensland

Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2021 4:26 pm    Post subject:

Quote:
I have been told that I must have at least one original crossmember.
. Justa thought ???? but does it say anywhere that this crossmember actually have to do anything???

Why cant it be grafted into the chassis in some out of the way place just to say its there. . It says it has to be there, does it say it has to be an original length or position.


A25chevrod
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Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2021 7:15 pm    Post subject:

Coupe, have you spoken to an engineer yet. The problem with getting advice on registration from fellow rodders is that there are more myths and legends out here than at a druid's convention. I assume the requirement for an original X member came from an earlier post of mine where I used the example of a friend of mine's 32 roadster on repro rails. In this case the engineer knows that it's a repro chassis and is happy so long as there is an original X member in there somewhere. Unfortunately it all depends on the engineer's interpretation of the requirements.
I'll give you another example of mate who bought a limited rego'ed Model A a couple of years ago. It has a Holden front, Jag rear, original chassis and steel cowl. At first he tried to go full rego but the engineer he was using said no way with the independents at both ends so he had to stay with the limited scheme. When all the kerfuffle started with that scheme a couple of months ago he tried again with a different engineer. This time he was successful and is on his way to full rego and a few extra grand on the resale value of his rod to boot.
This so called system is of course farcical and it may be ok for those who know their way around it but it can be a nightmare for the beginner and may even be limiting the growth of our sport here in NSW. This is one of the reasons why we need a national rego scheme. It'll never stop the myths and legends from doing the rounds but it will sure make the registration process a whole lot simpler and fairer for all.
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Pep
500RPM



Joined: 14 Jun 2021
Posts: 567
Location: Georges Hall, NSW

Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2021 9:02 am    Post subject:

Anonymous wrote:
Coupe, have you spoken to an engineer yet. The problem with getting advice on registration from fellow rodders is that there are more myths and legends out here than at a druid's convention. I assume the requirement for an original X member came from an earlier post of mine where I used the example of a friend of mine's 32 roadster on repro rails. In this case the engineer knows that it's a repro chassis and is happy so long as there is an original X member in there somewhere. Unfortunately it all depends on the engineer's interpretation of the requirements.
I'll give you another example of mate who bought a limited rego'ed Model A a couple of years ago. It has a Holden front, Jag rear, original chassis and steel cowl. At first he tried to go full rego but the engineer he was using said no way with the independents at both ends so he had to stay with the limited scheme. When all the kerfuffle started with that scheme a couple of months ago he tried again with a different engineer. This time he was successful and is on his way to full rego and a few extra grand on the resale value of his rod to boot.
This so called system is of course farcical and it may be ok for those who know their way around it but it can be a nightmare for the beginner and may even be limiting the growth of our sport here in NSW. This is one of the reasons why we need a national rego scheme. It'll never stop the myths and legends from doing the rounds but it will sure make the registration process a whole lot simpler and fairer for all.



Your right in most ways Choco ( I guess its you by your hand writing ). I know there are different interpretations on the rules but ultimately you are under the mercy of the RTA and they can veto an engineer at will...so you don't let them know too much for your own sake. The rules state an original chassis does not have to comply with the current ADRs...also the chassis can be modified to a degree but the rails and one cross member have to be original...that's black and white.
Here is the story of my 34 when I tried to get it passed in NSW. It was registered in Vic.....had a dropped tube axel and still had the transverse rear. Every cross member and rails were original but partially boxed....you couldn't get any more original than this. The engineer that I chose from the list was close to where I lived so I engaged him to inspect it. He looks under the car and says...gee, this is close to individually constructed!...I just about choked on my sandwich...I replied back and asked...how many rods have you inpected?...he replies, Oh this is the first since I took redundancy from the RTA...I thought I was in trouble. He continued the inspection and appeared very dillagent. He then took it for a drive and came back with a big grin...It looked like he had a good time. He then says all I needed was to get the wiper ( yes I only had one but he didn't know any differnt ...he assumed they originally only had one ) needed to wipe a little faster...and I needed a demister. I wound the windscreen out and asked if thats good enough...he say Oh yeah that'll be OK....I was quitely amused by this time....He then says that when I get the wiper fixed and the rear wheels changed to give him a call. I asked would he like to see the car again...he replies...No just come and get your report. ..To which I did......Back then you also had to present the car to the RTA at the pits. I fronted up with my report in hand and gave it to the RTA representitive...She ( yeah she ) took one look at it and says...Oh you had it inspected by ( name witheld for obvious reasons )...I said yeah, is there a problem?...she says Oh no, he used to work for the RTA and he wrote the manual we use to check for modified vehicles...and she plonks it down in front of me....Sure enough there was his name on this book. She says well if he's inspected it its a waste of time me going over it and proceeds to stamp the forms.

The moral is...pick your engineer wisely....use the ones that are used by rodders and get the clues on what they are pedantic on and what they are easy on. There is a degree of urban myth but there is also a element of pre warned is pre armed.
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choco
500RPM



Joined: 11 Jun 2021
Posts: 558
Location: Queanbeyan, NSW (on the ACT border)

Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2021 9:21 am    Post subject:

Errrr, that wasn't me!
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Brootal
500RPM



Joined: 11 Jun 2021
Posts: 804
Location: Sydney, Australia

Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2021 10:08 am    Post subject:

Sounds like good advice Pep. I'd say the "anonymous" post was written by bcal.

So how come you witheld the name Pep? Is the "obvious reason" so you can charge for your information???

BTW, I've still got all my original teef, so I figure a rattly old chassis will do me fine, plus I'm used to it with the Rambler AND Sydney roads!!!
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Pep
500RPM



Joined: 14 Jun 2021
Posts: 567
Location: Georges Hall, NSW

Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2021 10:45 am    Post subject:

Brootal wrote:
Sounds like good advice Pep. I'd say the "anonymous" post was written by bcal.

So how come you witheld the name Pep? Is the "obvious reason" so you can charge for your information???

BTW, I've still got all my original teef, so I figure a rattly old chassis will do me fine, plus I'm used to it with the Rambler AND Sydney roads!!!



Witheld cause I don't want to get him near a rod again...I was lucky that he was not rod literate but he could be dangerous by now....I recommend a guy out at Minto....his inspections are correct and sensible.....
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Popey
Rookie


Joined: 11 Jun 2021
Posts: 29
Location: Newcastle. NSW

Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2021 12:06 pm    Post subject:

The 'rules' are reasonably clear. The problem is interpretation, which varies from Engineer to Engineer, and RTA officer etc. Of course, it is also complicated by people pushing the limits of the rules and sometime getting away with it, and sometimes not. That is our nature as rodders.

I don't think the national scheme will necessarily fix this problem.
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coupe
Newbie



Joined: 26 Feb 2021
Posts: 7
Location: Sydney

Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2021 6:16 pm    Post subject: crossmember

Thankyou for all your replies. I hope that I am worrying about nothing and that I have no dramas in obtaining full rego in NSW.
Thanks again..
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bcal
Cruisin



Joined: 04 Feb 2021
Posts: 341
Location: The Shire, Sydney

Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2021 8:24 pm    Post subject:

Sorry about the orphan post fellas. I must remember to check my status before submitting.
I guess we all agree though that the current system is inadequate and that employing the services if the right engineer is of the utmost importance. At last Fridays Federation meeting we heard that the NSW RTA will not be accepting the National Scheme so we're going to be stuck with the status quo for some time to come. I wonder if this jeopardises its adoption by the other states?
Don't worry coupe you'll get your rod on the road one way or another. Fortunately we have a pretty good club scheme to fall back on and if you haven't done so already I would be contacting the Street Rod Committee. I have a car myself on club plates and it's real easy to get your rod on the road so long as you follow their guidelines and your rod is built to an acceptable standard. And at $150 a year it's worth the minor inconvenience of a phone call before you drive.
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choco
500RPM



Joined: 11 Jun 2021
Posts: 558
Location: Queanbeyan, NSW (on the ACT border)

Posted: Thu Mar 13, 2021 7:34 am    Post subject:

bcal wrote:
At last Fridays Federation meeting we heard that the NSW RTA will not be accepting the National Scheme so we're going to be stuck with the status quo for some time to come. I wonder if this jeopardises its adoption by the other states?


This was an issue that had several of the National Rego Scheme players concerned, but after every other state RTA and TAC member signed off on the document, it was obvious that NSW would be out on their own. Yes, it's true that they are influential, and this is not what we all wanted. However, as I stated before in a previous post, the precedent has already been set that a car that is legally registered in one state must be able to be registered in another. In fact, this was put to the NSW RTA, with the statement that NSW cars will simply get rego in Qld, Vic or ACT and then transfer it over to NSW (under the proposed National Rego Scheme). They had no answer, except to say that they'll cross that bridge when they come to it.
No one has yet explained to me why they would take this line. In fact, it is only one person's hard line that is upsetting the apple cart, so why? Having this legislation in place will take the weight off the RTAs in all states, inlcuiding NSW. As pre-48 rodders make up a very small fraction of road users, it is easy to see that the RTA can hardly justify expending resources to such a small, independant section of the driving public. With such a scheme in place, the administration is drastically reduced. It sounds too simple to write it off as one person's vindictive nature. Why would the NSW RTA look a gift horse in the mouth?
My 36 Plymouth is getting closer and closer to rego time, and while the SRC scheme looks very attractive, I like the idea of full rego. I also know that, under the current situation, it will be relatively easy to obtain. It means driving to Bargo for an engineer's certificate (what an excellent idea for a "shakedown" run!) but what if the NSW RTA has come good with its threat to pull all modified cars off full rego and onto concessional rego? WIll we be returning to the bad old days of illegally registering our cars and battling the Police and magenta gestapo day in and day out?
It's enough to make a shepherd phuck his sheep!
_________________
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
Frank Choco Munday, Technical Author
Hot Rod Handbooks
Phone: 0412 883 235 or (02) 6255 9810
Carburettors SUCK!
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
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bcal
Cruisin



Joined: 04 Feb 2021
Posts: 341
Location: The Shire, Sydney

Posted: Fri Mar 14, 2021 6:27 pm    Post subject:

choc wrote:
No one has yet explained to me why they would take this line. In fact, it is only one person's hard line that is upsetting the apple cart, so why? Having this legislation in place will take the weight off the RTAs in all states, inlcuiding NSW. As pre-48 rodders make up a very small fraction of road users, it is easy to see that the RTA can hardly justify expending resources to such a small, independant section of the driving public. With such a scheme in place, the administration is drastically reduced. It sounds too simple to write it off as one person's vindictive nature. Why would the NSW RTA look a gift horse in the mouth?


Maybe they see us as the thin edge of the wedge. First the rodders then the customisers, street machiners, kit builders, hill climbers and so on and so on.
Or maybe it is just one hardliner in the RTA as you say.

By the way, excuse my ignorance, who are the "Magenta Gestapo" . Magenta is a purply red colour and I've been racking my brain trying to figure out who wears this colour uniform . They can't be very nice whom ever they are .
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